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How does mixing cascade work?

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Monkey

Post subject: How does mixing cascade work?

Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 18:35

Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2012 17:39
Posts: 12

I read here that the IP's are mixed and passed on to the next Mix server, but am still confused about the details.

Let's say:

1. There are currently 7 clients (users)whose IP's are 11111, 22222,33333,44444,55555,66666,77777

2. All 7 users are using the same three Mix servers X, Y, and Z whose IP's are 90001, 90002, 90003 respectively

What happens to the IP's when requests from 1-7 go through X, Y, and then Z?

Sorry for being so confused.

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Monkey

Post subject: Re: How does mixing cascade work?

Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 18:46

Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2012 17:39
Posts: 12

Note: I am referring to the chart on
https://anonymous-proxy-servers.net/

Just trying understand conceptually what goes on during and between Mixing servers. No need for technical details.

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cane

Post subject: Re: How does mixing cascade work?

Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 18:55

Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2008 15:58
Posts: 1843

All clients have the same IP address from the view of the contacted webservices.

It is the IP address of the exit mix at the end of the cascade. The exit mix does not know any IP address of the users. It knows only the IP address of the middle mix. The mix knows only the IP addresses of the entry and the exit mix.

Only the entry mix knows the IP addresses of the users, but the entry mix can not look into the data packets. It is multiple encrypted.

Not the IP addresses are mixed but the traffic data packets.

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Monkey

Post subject: Re: How does mixing cascade work?

Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 19:38

Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2012 17:39
Posts: 12

Ah! I see. I wrongly thought that all user IP's are mixed together.

So it is a lot more similar to Tor than I previously thought.

It is similar to Tor in the sense that if 3 Mix cascade is used, then 3 layers of encryption is used like an onion (each layer is specifically prepared for each Mix server). Is that right?

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Georg Koppen

Post subject: Re: How does mixing cascade work?

Posted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 21:03

Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2008 18:02
Posts: 1054

Monkey wrote:

It is similar to Tor in the sense that if 3 Mix cascade is used, then 3 layers of encryption is used like an onion (each layer is specifically prepared for each Mix server). Is that right?

Yes, the main design difference is that our mix cascades are static while the Tor circuit is built out of a pool of Tor relays and refreshed every ten minutes.

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Monkey

Post subject: Re: How does mixing cascade work?

Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 6:38

Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2012 17:39
Posts: 12

Wow! I finally understand the mixing process. The JonDo mixing process has always been a mystery to me. I have always guessed wrongly that the Mixer mixes IP addresses.

Actually, each certified "Mixer" doesn't really mix anything, just relaying the package. Anonymity is achieved by the "Onion technique" together with pre-selected certified static Mixer(s). As you mentioned, the JonDo Mixing process and the Tor Onion technique are essentially the same.
1. Is the above description correct?

2. May I suggest that you also explain clearly on your website the "Onion technique" which is essential to JonDo anonymization process.

Note: I am repeating myself to make sure that I really understand it and so that future readers can read it and do not keep asking you the same question.

Thank you.

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cane

Post subject: Re: How does mixing cascade work?

Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 9:06

Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2008 15:58
Posts: 1843

Quote:

Is the above description correct?

Yes, without technical details it is correct. JonDonym and Tor are using onion encryption.

Mixing of packets like recommend by D. Chaum does not work for low latency networks. It is only used by remailers (2-12 hours latency).

Only to complete the comparison: the Invisible Internet Project (I2P) uses garlic encryption (not onion encryption), but it lacks scientific coverage. (Please ignore, if it is not interesting for you.)

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Monkey

Post subject: Re: How does mixing cascade work?

Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 17:30

Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2012 17:39
Posts: 12

Please direct me to good websites about anonymity, JonDo, Tor, and Garlic encryption (just the name itself is interesting enough already).

I also would like name of good forums to get answers for my Tor questions. Guess this forum would inappropriate for this.

I have no technical background, but am a good learner. This anonymity stuff is both challenging and useful in real life against my pretty much authoritarian government.

Thank you.

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AnonymousLife

Post subject: Re: How does mixing cascade work?

Posted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 20:54

Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2011 18:59
Posts: 191

Monkey,

Two points: First, what do you think of this article:

http://www.henrymakow.com/thailand_is_p ... d_for.html

Quote:

Here in Thailand, I rarely see a policeman. I have no idea what the police do all day, but they don't seem to eager to prey on the freedom of the local people.

There isn't the heavy hand of government here, so you can sense a joy of living, a positive outlook, that has disappeared in our Western countries.

by: Peter Forden, Peter4@allmail.NET
(for henrymakow.com)

I've been retired in Thailand six years -- from the USA.

One of your readers, "Alan" wrote:

"[In Thailand, if] ... unpopular laws are passed the populace just
ignores them until they are no longer enforced. In the west, we could
learn a lot from this way of life as we just allow our police to ride
roughshod over us with these ever increasing attacks on our personal
freedoms."

So true.

In Thailand, people generally take care of themselves -- without the
heavy hand of government in every direction. As a result, people are self-reliant, polite, and helpful to each other.

You can read the rest with the link.

Second,

Do you own a Socksifier? If not, you should really consider purchasing one. Proxifier and Proxycap are both good choices. With Proxifier, you can chain as many proxies you want. So for example: you start with JonDo (premium) then you may add other SOCKS4 and SOCKS5 proxies; or you can start with Tor and add more proxies.

This will enhance anonymity.

Also consider that a Socksifier is essential for third party plugins such as Java and Flash (for online videos).

I highly recommend you purchase one.

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Monkey

Post subject: Re: How does mixing cascade work?

Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2012 18:32

Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2012 17:39
Posts: 12

Hi Anonymous Life,

Yes, the article gives a fair picture of life in Thailand in general.

This picture is accurate as long as people, foreigners included, do not violate one sacred rule. Doing so, even by including few "inappropriate" words in your speech, your conversation, your note, your e-mail, or your mobile phone SMS can easily land you in jail for up to 15 years. Everyone must learn about this rule before they visit Thailand.

I cannot say anything more as I am surfing unprotected. This is why Thai people need, more than ever before, anonymity tools for their communications.

*It seems our best bet are Tor and JonDo.* I am learning.

May be some Thai person will come along and say more.

Thank you for the tool you mentioned. I will check it out although it may be over my head.

By the way, is it Socksifier or Proxifier?

Thanks again.

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